69 replies to this topic

[Pyroven]

"You get the idea – this is a long way off. Years. More than two. Like three or more. Definitely not soon." - Games Workshop, three years ago.

 

Games Workshop has clearly been following a cycle of three years since 2017. That is the modern expected length of an edition of AoS or 40k, and has been since 2014.

 

The years between editions are when Games Workshop releases their non-mainline games. They have been doing this in a predictable fashion since 2017. It goes Mainline Edition, Skirmish Version, Hardcore/Forgeworld Version.

 

Note: Not listed are Necromunda 2017 or Adeptus Titanicus 2018... or Aeronautica Imperialis. Maybe the system is less perfect than I am intent it be. 

 

But anyway, here are some good examples of this system in action with Warhammer Sci-Fi:

 

2014 - 40k 7th Edition (Mainline)

2015 -

2016 -

2017 - 40k 8th Edition (Mainline)

2018 - Kill Team 2nd Edition (Skirmish)

2019 - Apocalypse (Hardcore)

2020 - 40k 9th Edition (Mainline)

2021 - Kill Team 3rd Edition (Skirmish)

2022 - Horus Heresy 2nd Edition (Hardcore/Prequel)

2023 - 40k 10th Edition (Mainline)

 

And less reliable overrall, but equally steady since 2018, Warhammer 'Fantasy':

 

2015 - Age of Sigmar 1st Edition (Mainline)

2016 - Blood Bowl (Hardcore?)

2017 - Age of Sigmar Skirmish Supplement (Skirmish)

2018 - Age of Sigmar 2nd Edition (Mainline)

2019 - Warcry 1st Edition (Skirmish)

2020 - Blood Bowl (Hardcore?)

2021 - Age of Sigmar 3rd Edition (Mainline)

2022 - Warcry 2nd Edition (Skirmish)

2023 - Old World? (Hardcore/Prequel)

(Unfortunately both Bloodbowl and Warcry are quite neglected on the Lexicanum)

 

As you can see, these past two years Age of Sigmar and Warcry have been releasing in the same pattern but just one step behind their Sci-Fi Counterparts, 40k and Kill Team. So if the 40k prequel released last year, then this year we should expect to see the Age of Sigmar Prequel (A parallel they alluded to in one of their very first announcement teasers for the Old World*)

 

Another reason to back up the sense that the Old World will release this year, is that this is the 40th anniversary of Warhammer Fantasy 1st Edition. Those of us old enough to have lived through a few Warhammer or White Dwarf anniversaries know games workshop loves to commemorate.

 

So, on the contrary why haven't we seen any leaks for the Old World? We've seen a good chunk for 10th Edition Warhammer 40k. I believe It's probably primarily due to lower popularity. Of the three games 40k, Fantasy and Lord of The Rings, Fantasy was a very far behind third.^{See 'The Painting Phase YouTube Channel, peachy mentioned it recently.} Even Age of Sigmar, though Clearly healthier, is still minute in popularity compared to the juggernaut that 40k is. It could also just be chance, leaks happen sporadically.

 

Some other information about the Old World you may already know:

• Square bases are a certainty
• Orcs will be Orcs
• You will be able to use your old models
• It will be primarily focused on the 'Old World' part of the Warhammer Fantasy map (i.e. not the Americas)
• It is a prequel to Fantasy, set in the time of the Three Emperors, approximately 300 years ahead.
• The Old World and Total War: Warhammer III are somewhat coordinated in their designs. Examples including Kislev and Cathay.
• It will be Forgeworld-managed. That is not to say it will be all Forgeworld resin, indeed Forgeworld itself seems to be disappearing more and more into normal GW plastics.

 

Some rumours and/or speculation I've heard about it that I believe makes sense:

• Confirmedish (They will have PDF rules): There may be Chaos Dwarfs - The refresh of the Legion of Azgorh has been long rumoured at this point. I remember even before the models were removed from Forgeworld I knew they were not much longer for this world. There are going to be Chaos Dwarfs (maybe there already are?) in Total War: Warhammer III. If the teams are coordinating, then it seems there would logically be new Chaos Dwarf minis inbound.
• Confirmed: Base sizes may be increasing: (added 2023-03-08)

 

Complete list of Warhammer Community Articles about The Old World:

• 2019-09-15   Old World? New Warhammer!!
• 2020-02-06   Cartography in the Old World
• 2020-03-23   The Old World: Ice Guard of Kislev
• 2020-05-11   Old World Update: Bears!
• 2020-12-28   The Old World – Your First Look at the Map of Bretonnia
• 2021-07-21   Square Bases and Kislev Ascendant – See Your Questions About Warhammer: The Old World Answered
• 2021-08-07   Discover Warhammer: The Old World’s Ultimate Getaway for Exiled Lords and Rotten Princes
• 2022-02-18   Grand Cathay is Mapped for the First Time in Warhammer: The Old World
• 2022-08-14   Warhammer: The Old World – Orcs, Bretonnians, Tomb Kings Arrive
• 2023-01-13   Old World Development Diary – Explore the war torn lands of the World-that-Was
• 2023-02-06   Old World Development Diary – Walk Like a Nehekharan in the Land of the Dead
• 2023-03-13   Old World Development Diary – Revealing the Weapons of War
• 2023-04-14   Old World Development Diary – On Bases and the Barons of Bretonnia
• um oops
• 2023-05-23   Old World Development Diary – The Main Factions Revealed

* Citation Needed because my dumb brain can't work out where to find it.

Edited by Pyroven, 23 May 2023 - 03:43 PM.

[thorpyuk]

As long as there's Dwarves, I'll be happy!

[herjan1987]

They are quite strong roumors about, that some classic minis will reappear. Like Bretonnian, Tomb Kings and Orcs and Goblins plastics.

[Thoric]

I am not especially interested in miniatures. I am curious about rules. If it will be a monstruosity like the 8th edition, we will stick to our beloved 6th.

[Pyroven]

I am not especially interested in miniatures. I am curious about rules. If it will be a monstruosity like the 8th edition, we will stick to our beloved 6th.

They've said it'll be a mixture of the best bits from every edition, I would be surprised if it was very similar to 8th.

They probably won't go heavy into massive armies either, because 40k Apocalypse from 2019 was a huge failure. My local GW only sold 2 copies of a stock of 20 of that edition of apocalypse.

Edited by Pyroven, 08 March 2023 - 09:26 PM.

[Pyroven]

This video is really well made and is well worth watching.

 

[herjan1987]

On the Eigth Edition for Life (https://eefl.freeforums.net ) there are some roumors from the user called Discoqing:

Mainly 7th ed rules, with some changes.
Subdued magic
360 arc of sight for some units
Random charging is gone. Back to double movement
Premeasuring is still a thing

Also the rulebook is already printed and they are going to release it by the end of this year.

[thorpyuk]

That's me out if true... random charges were one of the best changes in 8th

[Thoric]

Hail, Dwarf-Brothers!

 

The random charges were an aberration. Good only for the players who don't want to accept a basic truth: Dwarfs are a slow, static, defensive army.

Why transform it in something else?

[Thoric]

One thing is important. Go back to the former rules of the 6th, when if you run in an enemy unit after pursuing or destroying a unit you do not fight immediatlly, but in the next turn. Giving the opponent the chance to counterchange in his movement phase. This change from the 6th to the 7th edition was what made the Dwarfs impossible to be competitive unless led by a Runelord with the Anvil.

[thorpyuk]

I disagree Thoric, about the random charges. When I first read about them, I really hated the idea too.. but the more I played them, the more I realised that it was an excellent addition and really added another element of strategy.. do you go for the long charge & risk an exposed flank? Or hold the line?
I agree it was a good change for Dwarfs because instead of charging a piddly 6", we get between 6" and 15"

[thorpyuk]

On pursuit into another enemy, correct me if I'm wrong, but I dont believe you do fight right away in 8th do you? (Not sure about 7th)

[Kallstrom]

In 8th edition, if you pursue into a new enemy, you only resolve that fight in the same turn if that enemy was already engaged in a fight with another one of your units (and that fight had not been resolved yet this turn). Quite a rare circumstance.

 

Personally I love the random elements of war gaming (it helps keeping my brain interested and engaged throughout the match), and I enjoy the randomness more than the strategic bits since to me it makes for more memorable moments. But I think that is also mainly because I don't play competitively at all, so it does not really matter to me who wins as long as the overall narrative of the battle feels exciting. Hence why I enjoy the random charges. I can take the downside of not rolling what I want in stride, because it is worth the thrill of important moments coming down to very specific dice rolls. 

This is quite the opposite to the, in my opinion, more common mindset of enjoying the game as a strategic experiment where failing a charge because of bad dice rolls can become annoying. I understand that setting up the perfect play and then see everything come undone because you failed to roll a total of 5 with two dice must be aggrevating if the goal of the game is to plan and execute an effective strategy.

 

As for the Old World as a game, I reckon that whatever rules they choose to incorporate into that system will displease everybody in some way, shape, or form. Taking "the best bits" from every edition is such a subjective approach that sets itself up to fail regardless of the creators intentions since everybody has a different idea of what the best bits are.

I for one will try to give the game an honest and fair try, and hopefully it will tick enough of my boxes to make me interested in engaging more with all coming content as well. I  really long for the feeling of having a physical book filled with art and lore in my hand again that feels fresh, new, and a sign of a many great things to come.

[herjan1987]

Bretonnians and Tomb Kings are having shiny new plastic kits and they are shown of in this Warhammer Community article:

https://www.warhamme...weapons-of-war/

Edited by herjan1987, 13 March 2023 - 04:00 PM.

[Pyroven]

Bretonnians and Tomb Kings are having shiny new plastic kits and they are shown of in this Warhammer Community article:

https://www.warhamme...weapons-of-war/

 

This fascinates me, though it makes sense. This says to me that the older plastic kits probably won't be re-released but rather will be updated. I don't see any reason 8th Edition Fantasy plastic kits wouldn't be re-released though.

 

So from there we can probably make an educated bet that the plastic Thunderers/Quarrellers kit and the plastic Warriors/Longbeards (with masks) kits won't be coming back. Especially seeing as they discontinued those kits more recently, with the Cities of Sigmar (2019) Battleome, rumouredly in part due to their simplistic style/detail. (As well as reducing function overlap with Empire/Freeguild Crossbowmen and Handgunners)

[herjan1987]

I got news! I run a small TOW news page on Facebook and one of my followers have been at Adepticon, where he claims to have spoken with some UK players, who are close to GW. They said to him the following:

The smallest base size will be 25 mm. He didnt know that other base sizes will change.

Tomb Kings skeletons, horse riders, chariots are comming back, aswell as Bretonnian men-at-arms, long bowmen and plastic knight kit.

Stater set will be Tomb Kings vs Bretonnians

And there are going to be new models aswell for both sides

Most importantly the game will drop ín 6 months time in Fall.

I take these with a pinch of salt of course

Edited by herjan1987, 29 March 2023 - 01:31 PM.

[Skull Krusher]

Would be nice if it came true... I will continue to use the old codexes to write my tales of Kraka Drakka in the Preachers Corner... I have another story that I am writing....

[herjan1987]

Did you guys read the newest article?

https://www.warhamme...ent=tow14042023

In it they say that base size changes is a thing so smallest base is going to be 25 mm.

Old modells are comming back. They already showed off the Bretonnian ones and one Orcs and Goblins unit in a blurr.

[Pyroven]

Did you guys read the newest article?

https://www.warhamme...ent=tow14042023

In it they say that base size changes is a thing so smallest base is going to be 25 mm.

Old modells are comming back. They already showed off the Bretonnian ones and one Orcs and Goblins unit in a blurr.

 

Very exciting stuff, all I really want from Bretonnia is the chance to buy the old kits. I really hope they don't increase the prices too much though otherwise it will be moot, I can't afford to pay modern GW prices for anything.

 

Highly entertaining watching everyone lose their minds about the base size changes. I've never seen such ludicrous reactions to an entirely non-issue in my life.

 

I've been considering making a post about base sizes just to link people to when they're overreacting to maybe spread some sense, but in the mean time I recommend taking a glance here.

 

You can always make smaller bases bigger, you can never make bigger bases smaller.

 

No one knows if the new 'Large infantry' base size is definitely 30mm yet? I presume it must be

[Thunderförge]

I think the ultimate solution is magnetised bases. Your figures can then be magnetised to whatever size base you need for any given game. :-)