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Runic Additions And Amendments

rune addition next book

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#1 Saintspirit

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 08:38 PM

As there are no Rules Development part on this forum, I figured this would be the best place to post this. It is now so, that I thought it could be fun to make up some new runes.

 

Armour Rune:

Rune of Reflection - 25 points

RuneofReflection_zps1454fed4.png

What is most important to remember when forging this rune, is that the armour has a small piece of a mirror somewhere on it, as the rune will reflects attacks as well as mirrors reflects the picture of the warrior.

 

Multiples of this rune have no further effect. For each successful Armour Save made, the armour inflicts a hit against the enemy that struck the blow, with the same Strength as the attack.

 

Weapon Rune:

Master Rune of Thunder - 55 points

MasterRuneofThunder2_zps5a3b1abd.png

When a hammer inscribed with this rune is swinged, it will project bolts of lightning from its head.

 

The wielder of a weapon with this rune may forfiet all his attacks to make one special attack. If he decides to do, take the small blast template and place it anywhere in base contact with the wielder - all models at least partially under the template then takes one Strength 4 hit (note that any additional runes will not take effect).

 

These are of course not really finished, there are some things I am not sure of. If you have any opinions, feel free to help.


Edited by Saintspirit, 25 November 2013 - 10:08 AM.


#2 Oridur

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 05:10 AM

Hehe, at first I was thinking something very "zen" when you said "Rune of Reflection."



#3 Alrik Ogregrudge

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:06 PM

I like the idea of creating your own runes, you can always ask your opponent if they are willing to play against invented runes :)

 

Maybe make the Thunder Masterrune a little bit more expensive and give it a chainlightning ability a bit like the TK casket? 18" D6 hits S4 when out of combat, and when a wound is caused, it jumps to another unit withing 6". In Close Combat giving the wielder multiple hits D3 on his normal attacks or something, so you cannot only use it when out of CC.

 

Then give the breathweapon template to another flamelike or freezing rune :)

 

Edit: Or make the Master Rune combinable with the Master Rune of Flight so it can cause even more wounds? 

*Not accidentally similar to Mjölnir :P :D *


Edited by Alrik Ogregrudge, 11 March 2013 - 02:09 PM.


#4 David L

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 03:32 PM

As there are no Rules Development part on this forum

Actually there is. The Fields Beyond.

Thread moved.



#5 Saintspirit

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:08 PM

Aha! Thanks very much, David L.

 

I like the idea of creating your own runes, you can always ask your opponent if they are willing to play against invented runes :)

 

Maybe make the Thunder Masterrune a little bit more expensive and give it a chainlightning ability a bit like the TK casket? 18" D6 hits S4 when out of combat, and when a wound is caused, it jumps to another unit withing 6". In Close Combat giving the wielder multiple hits D3 on his normal attacks or something, so you cannot only use it when out of CC.

 

Then give the breathweapon template to another flamelike or freezing rune :)

 

Edit: Or make the Master Rune combinable with the Master Rune of Flight so it can cause even more wounds? 

*Not accidentally similar to Mjölnir :P :D *

Hm, those ideas about the MR of Thunder isn't at all bad, I'll take them in consideration ;) I was actually thinking about making some SC who had found and now wielded the Stormherald, a legendary hammer with both MR of Thunder and Flight, so I actually already had that idea in mind (but as you say, it's not at all accidentaly similar to Mjölnir ^_^).

 

Also, some template runes sounds like a nice concept, Such as the Dragon Rune and the Rune of Frost, or something?

 

Two other things, which I think should be changed to the runes in next armybook, is 1. that the MR of Flight would become a common rune instead, alternatively was made better, and 2. that as the Rune of Stoicism isn't existing anymore, its picture would instead be used for the Rune of Brotherhood or the MR of Dismay, since they now look exactly the same.


Edited by Saintspirit, 11 March 2013 - 07:37 PM.


#6 Alrik Ogregrudge

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 12:32 AM

First of all, thank you David. 

 

Then, runes. 

 

Runes having the same runes (if you know what I mean) is indeed a bit sloppy, let´s hope they fix that in next editions :)

 

But  I think they shouldn't make the Mrune of Flight a non-Masterrune. As then you could outfit all your Lords and Thanes with a strong ranged weapon. It might even be over powered as you can combine it with the Master rune of Skalf Blackhammer (automatically hit, wound on a 2+, even against giant T8 TK kittykats) . Although a very nice idea.

 

 

Reading on, I see Master rune of Flight with rune of Might and Cleaving gives you the same result against a T8 monster. But then combine it with Mrune of Breaking, automatically destroying an enemy magic weapon. 

 

Overall I think it's to powerfull. 

 

On to the Dragon Rune and Rune of Frost, make 'em relative cheap Masterrunes breathweapons with the breath template. So you can use the special ability once a game (in or out of combat, check rulebook for breathweapons) , for this reason they are cheaper and again Masterrunes so you can't spam them on your characters. Let the Mrune of the Dragon have magical flaming attacks, S3 or S4 and the Mrune of Frostbite with one strenght less but lets the enemy unit which is hit have minus 1 initiative or attacks.

Something like this? :)

 

Last, combining Masterrunes for special characters seems to be possible as Highking Thorgrim has a triple Masterrune weapon. (Though I wouldn't create another weapon with 3 Masterrunes, he might get jealous! :P )

 



#7 Saintspirit

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:39 AM

About the MR of Flight, that is true of course, however as it is now, it just feels like it is never taken at all (since it is a Master Rune). Either everyone takes it or no one? We need some way to give it some balance...

 

Then the MR of the Dragon would, as you said, give a flaming breath weapon attack. The one of some sort of Frost, however, I think could instead make some kind of ranged attack similar to the Frost Nova in WC3, like a short ranged stone thrower attack which reduces the initiative until your next shooting phase. Then there would be three ranged runes, each one of a particular element - how does that sound?

(I will draw them, in case you wondered)



#8 Alrik Ogregrudge

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 10:00 PM

I´ll be looking forward to your drawings! 

 

And I agree, the MR of Flight should be made a little bit more viable, because it´s a way to cool rune not to use :)

 

And guessing for your elemental runes there would be Earth/stone and Air next to the ones you already have. You can even make it a little group of the 'Elemental Five' (as you can see Lightning as the fifth element; ether) Sounds a bit overkill to me, maybe cut the number down a bit. 

 

 

Three sounds good x)

Then I would keep it to the elements Dwarfs know from their surroundings like Eart Fire and Water (Frost) 

 

Keep the Lightning Rune though!  I will try and get my friends to let me use it! :)

 

It's late for me now, so I'll cook up some rules later :)

 



#9 Saintspirit

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 09:40 AM

Hm, I was thinking some about having a group known as the "Slayer Runes" (considering slayers are somewhat more feral than regular dwarfs) and they would then be the elemental runes (and perhaps a few more). What to include should IMHO be at least

- Master Rune of the Thunderbolt

- Master Rune of the Dragonbreath

- Master Rune of the Frostbite

 

That's then Thunder, Dragons (Fire) and Frost with some cooler names. If something was to be added to them, I suppose (as you mentioned) that would be Earth - perhaps Earthquake? Slam the hammer into the ground and watch the earth break in two?

 

In any case, I think the best concept for each one would be

 

Thunderbolt: Simple ranged attack, perhaps with Chain Lightning possible (alternatively what I wrote before)

Dragonbreath: Flaming breath weapon

Frostbite: Short-ranged stonethrower attack, reducing initiative or movement

Earthquake: Bouncing cannonball attack

 

How does that sound?

 

Here's by the way the Dragon Rune:

 

Oh, and also - I hope they'll let you use it, Alrik! :)



#10 Alrik Ogregrudge

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 10:31 PM

I like these concepts very much! 

 

Just one little question though, would you want to keep them simple or a bit more complicated? Because now they just are different template weapons according to the rules, which is fine in my opinion if it is ment to be kept simple. Personally I would like to see a bit more "character", not just in names but in effect too. 

 

Something like this maybe: 

Master Rune of Thunderbolt; 

   Mostly only hammers are inscribed with this rune and only the wealthiest of Lords can afford these weapons, for they are not only trapped with magic like other magical weapons  but also with lightning. Needles to say gathering these fowerful forces is a risky business for any Runesmith. 

 

  Gives the wearer a Chain Lightning attack which can be used instead of this regular attacks. Roll to hit as normal for close combat. If hit, the enemy unit suffers D3+3 S5 wounds. If a single wound is caused, a Lightning fork hops to another unit within 6" dealing D3+2 S4 wounds. Every bounce causes the next attack to have -1 wound and -1 Strength. This bounce continues until no more wounds are caused, there are no more enemy units within range or the strength drops below 1. No unit can be hit more than once from the same Chain Lightning. 

This is the only Master Rune that can be combined with the Master Rune of Flight. When combined, the wearer can cast Chain Lightning in the shooting phase with 18" Range for the first impacts. The Chain Lightning then can still bounce and the wearer cannot cast this ability again in the same turn. (Maybe even give it 'No armour saves allowed' because I believe it fits real world circumstances but then it might get to powerful?) 

 

 

It's late now, more runes next time! :)

 

Edit: P.S. After what I wrote here I really do Saintspirit! :)


Edited by Alrik Ogregrudge, 18 March 2013 - 10:33 PM.


#11 Saintspirit

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:52 AM

I think what you suggests there sounds very nice; though perhaps somewhat edited, to something like this -

 

Master Rune of the Thunderbolt; 


MasterRuneofThunder2_zps5a3b1abd.png

   It is almost only hammers that are inscribed with this rune and only the
wealthiest of Lords can afford them, for they do not only
trap magic like other magical weapons, but also actual lightning.
Needless to say gathering these fowerful forces is a risky business for
any Runesmith. 


  This gives the wearer a Chain Lightning attack which can be used instead
of this regular attacks. Roll to hit as normal for close combat. If
hit, the enemy unit suffers D3+3 S5 magical hits. If a single wound is caused,
a Lightning fork hops to another enemy unit within 6" dealing D3+2 S4 wounds. Every bounce causes the next attack to have -1 wound and -1 Strength. This bounce continues until no more wounds are caused, there are no more
enemy units within range or the strength drops below 1. No unit can be
hit more than once from the same Chain Lightning. 


This is the only Master Rune that can be combined with the Master
Rune of Flight. When combined, the wearer can cast Chain Lightning in
the shooting phase with 18" Range for the first impacts. The Chain
Lightning can then still bounce in the same way as described above,

and the wielder cannot cast this ability again during his next turn. (Not completely sure about that last addition - was it that you intended to write?)

 

Still not completely sure about what it should cost, but I think it shouldn't be far too expensive taking in consideration the cost of the MRoF as well. Something like 45 or 50 pts?



#12 Alrik Ogregrudge

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 06:05 PM

I was doing the last bit from memory alone and so later I found a few things that weren´t correct. 

First the MRoFlight is more expensive than I thought :P

Second, changing the word 'wounds' with 'hits' sounds like a good idea. Should make up for "no armor saves allowed".

And last, MRoFlight has 12" range instead of 18"

 

I think we are allowed to do something funny with the point cost. Maybe make it 50 points but when combined with MRoF it only costs 30 points.

Or make it 20 points and one use only.  

 

And the last addition you mentioned was indeed intended that way. My mastery of the English language is not top shelf so please correct me if you feel the need :P. Maybe it was a bit redundant to name this rule but I felt it was needed. Maybe someone somehow knows how to use it twice in the same turn. 

 

Then it should look something like this; 

 

Master Rune of the Thunderbolt                     50 points / 20 points, one use only. 


MasterRuneofThunder2_zps5a3b1abd.png

   It is almost only hammers that are inscribed with this rune and only the
wealthiest of Lords can afford them, for they do not only
trap magic like other magical weapons, but also actual lightning.
Needless to say gathering these fowerful forces is a risky business for
any Runesmith. 


  This gives the wearer a Chain Lightning attack which can be used instead of this regular attacks. Roll to hit as normal for close combat. If hit, the enemy unit suffers D3+3 S5 magical hits with no armour saves allowed. If a single wound is caused, a Lightning fork hops to another enemy unit within 6" dealing D3+2 S4 hits. Every bounce causes the next attack to have -1 hit and -1 Strength. This bounce continues until no more wounds are caused, there are no more enemy units within range or the strength drops below 1. No unit can be hit more than once from the same Chain Lightning. 


This is the only Master Rune that can be combined with the Master Rune of Flight. (This makes the Master Rune of the Thunderbolt 20 points cheaper, bringing it down to 30 points. ) When combined, the wearer can cast Chain Lightning in the shooting phase with 12" Range for the first impacts. The Chain Lightning can then still bounce in the same way as described above, and the wielder cannot cast this ability again during the same turn.

 


Edited by Alrik Ogregrudge, 25 March 2013 - 10:07 PM.


#13 Saintspirit

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 10:01 AM

I've been continuing thinking about these four runes, and made up some relatively simple rule for them;

first of all, their names are, as mentioned, the

 

- Master Rune of the Thunderbolt

- Master Rune of the Dragonbreath

- Master Rune of the Frostbite

- Master Rune of the Earthquake.

 

Next, these are the only Master Runes able to be combined with another Master Rune, which is then the Master Rune of Flight.

 

Their basic rules are:

One Use Only

MRotT - Forfeit all attacks for Chain Lightning attack, S5, either KB or no AS (not sure), bounces 6"and weakens for each bounce.

MRotD - Forfeit all attacks for Breath Weapon attack, S4, Flaming.

MRotF - Forfeit all attacks for 2D6 S2 automatic hits, Armour Piercing, the attacked unit has Initiative 1 for D3 rounds.

MRotE - Forfeit all attacks for small blast template anywhere in base contact, all models under are hit, takes one S3 hit and the attacked unit have -1 to hit until the beginning of your next turn.

 

 

Then, the basic rules when combined with MRoF:

One Use Only

MRotT - Shooting attack, Range 12", hits and bounces just as with the regular attack.

MRotD - Shooting attack following the Fire Thrower rules, except that you may not miscast (just re-roll the artillery dice) and that you may move and shoot.

MRotF - Shooting attack, Range 12", 2D6 S2 automatic hits, Armour Piercing, the attacked unit has Initiative 1 for D3 rounds.

MRotE - Shooting Attack, draw a straight line of 12 + 2D6" long and 1" wide, each model under the line takes one S3 hit and are -1 to hit (both chooting and close combat) until the beginning of your next turn.

______________________________________________________________________________________________

That then is what I have in mind for them for now, I know the thunderbolt has gained more complicated rules several times, but I prefer having everything together in basic form before making them more advanced.

Some things that I am not sure about is f.ex. the points - if they will all be One Use Only (which does feel quite fitting, particularly since breath weapons are ouo anyway), I suppose that your idea with the lower point cost if combined with MRoF is not that of a bad idea after all? Also, a master rune which is ouo shouldn't be that expensive, IMHO...

 

Maybe something like this?

MRotT - 50, 25 with Flight

MRotD - 30, 15 with Flight

MRotF - 45, 20 with Flight

MRotE - 40, 20 with Flight

 

Also, not sure if you should have to roll to hit with the Thunderbolt, if it is ouo, especially when the other three are (at least now) automatic hits, as well as the MRoFlight.

 

And one more thing - should combining a rune with Flight remove the melee attack and replace it with the shooting attack, just add the shooting attack, or add the shooting attack but remove both when one has been used?


Edited by Saintspirit, 02 April 2013 - 10:49 AM.


#14 Alrik Ogregrudge

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 08:39 PM

It´s been a while now, have been busy with my social life for a change so apologies for the late reply :)

 

First I would add the note "not usable as a stand and shoot reaction" to every Rune-MRoFlight combination and make them all magical attacks. Quite useful against a few opponents I'd say, plus, it fits the fluff. I would also say that these four MRunes their abilities are not effected by other Runes added to the weapon, although normal attacks are. 

 

Then I would say for the MRotT to be no armour saves allowed, not Killing Blow. On the other hand, as KB might be too powerful, I always find 'no armour saves allowed' a bit lacking. Especially with higher Str. attacks. Concluding; I'm not sure either xD

 

 

 

And;

MRotD - Forfeit all attacks for Breath Weapon attack, S4, Flaming.

MRotF - Forfeit all attacks for 2D6 S2 automatic hits, Armour Piercing, the attacked unit has Initiative 1 for D3 rounds.

 

Why not make the MRotF also a breathweapon? As for breathweapons are 2D6 (automatic) hits in close combat anyway.

 

Let's keep them OUO now, and let them be a bit cheaper, for it feels quite a lot for just a OUO. I'd make 'em all, let's say, 30/20 except for MRorT at 35/25? 

 

Ow, I would like 'em all to be automatic hits as the MRoFlight normally describes. And I always had in mind that the MRoFlight just adds both shooting attack and melee attack but whenever one is used, the other goes away aswell, conform 'OUO'. 

 

 



#15 Saintspirit

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 09:40 AM

It´s been a while now, have been busy with my social life for a change so apologies for the late reply :)

That's no problem, I have so many other armies to work on anyway.

 

First I would add the note "not usable as a stand and shoot reaction"

to every Rune-MRoFlight combination and make them all magical attacks.
Quite useful against a few opponents I'd say, plus, it fits the fluff. I
would also say that these four MRunes their abilities are not effected
by other Runes added to the weapon, although normal attacks are. 

 

Agreed, that does sound logical.

 

Then
I would say for the MRotT to be no armour saves allowed, not Killing
Blow. On the other hand, as KB might be too powerful, I always find 'no
armour saves allowed' a bit lacking. Especially with higher Str.
attacks. Concluding; I'm not sure either xD

 

Exactly - think that has to be put on ice for at least a while.

 

And;


MRotD - Forfeit all attacks for Breath Weapon attack, S4, Flaming.


MRotF - Forfeit all attacks for 2D6 S2 automatic hits, Armour Piercing, the attacked unit has Initiative 1 for D3 rounds.


 

Why not make the MRotF also a breathweapon? As for breathweapons are 2D6 (automatic) hits in close combat anyway.

 

Hmm - the thing is manely that I prefer to think the MRotF as some sort of WC3 Frost Nova attack, you know, an explosion of ice coming out of nowhere (although you need Flight to make it ranged). Also, I think it is preferable if these four runes all are relatively different. It is mostly estetic thoughts I suppose, but somewhat important nonetheless.

 

 

Let's keep them OUO now, and let them
be a bit cheaper, for it feels quite a lot for just a OUO. I'd make 'em
all, let's say, 30/20 except for MRorT at 35/25? 


Ow, I would like 'em all to be automatic hits as the MRoFlight
normally describes. And I always had in mind that the MRoFlight just
adds both shooting attack and melee attack but whenever one is used, the
other goes away aswell, conform 'OUO'.

 

Yes, making them cheaper with OUO sound ok I think. Also, considering how many of them which does cause automatic hits, why not make them all do.

Finally, yes, that's pretty much what I had in mind as well, although I suppose that the normal Master Rune of Flight won't go away when you use that other rune-shooting attack - you can still throw the hammer, but it won't breath fire anymore :)







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