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1000Pt Vs Empire And Bret

empire bretonnia bretonnian

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#1 Paddy94

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 10:26 PM

Hi

I am playing a friendly game against a couple of people who are both respectively fielding there new armies. I have never faced either before though.

On one hand I expect to face Bretonnians who may field a selection of 24 Knights, 3 Pegasus Knights, a mounted BSB or a mounted wizard. (That's what he said he had and I don't have a copy of his army book so don't know what the most likely combination would be).

My second opponent will be fielding Empire, but I have no idea what to expect.

I was thinking though

1 RS
2 x 20 Quarrellers with GW
1 GT
1 Cannon
2 x Organ Guns

I know I am Rune free but I think I can risk the GT & Cannon misfiring if I have the gun line to deter any cavalry charge. Also the GT would probably only be used to hit any Empire war machines (the Bret's won't have any)

Any suggestions welcome!

#2 Tegnus Vagnarsson

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Posted 02 May 2012 - 12:19 AM

I have never played against Bretonians or the new Empire but I imagine that brets will just gallop across and run straight through your list. They have the capability to be fast enough that a gun line won't be able to kill enough before it's too late.

Against Empire though you should do very well. Usually against empire it comes down to who wins the artillery war and you have enough 'guns' that I think you should be able to do that. Just make sure you shoot his cannons first. The only problem is you have left out what makes our army unique and our primary source of strength. Runes. Without runes our cannons are worse than the empires and a GT without Ro Acc and Ro Pen isn't going to do much, especially in 1000 points where targets are few and far between so a scatter of almost any sort will result in a miss. Not to mention that magic can be devastating at 1000 points and you only have +1 DD to protect against it and an easy to kill general.

If it was me I would not bring a gun line at all. A Runesmith, a couple of combat units and a couple of cannons is all you need :)

Edited by Tegnus Vagnarsson, 02 May 2012 - 12:22 AM.


#3 Paddy94

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Posted 02 May 2012 - 09:46 PM

Thanks for the info, so i was thinking of dropping an organ gun in favour of a RoF for the cannon and RoAc for the GT, oh and also a talisman with 2 dispel runes.

I have to admit the prospect of fighting against a horde of cavalry only makes me unsure of what to field, I just reckon that 40 Quarrellers split into reg of 20 ( over 2 ranks) so I might have a inital hail and possibly another stand and fire reaction before taking them on with GW

#4 Tegnus Vagnarsson

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 09:50 AM

Ro Acc. is a good start for the GT but at S3 you are going to loose out on a lot of wounds when you finally get a hit. At least 1 Ro Pen would be advisable. Because your enemies are primarily T3 it should be enough, but S5 would be better if you can squeeze the points.

I'm thinking with all that armour, even the -1 from S4, they will just shrug off most of the hits you get.
Assuming they pray for the extra ward save, you should get 2 turns to shoot and then one stand and shoot. Most of the time you will need 5's to hit (long range, stand and shoot), 100 shots (both units shooting first turn, then one unit standing and shooting) will get 33 hits (on average), assuming T3 you'll get 22 wounds of which 7 will get past their armour and then 5 past their ward save.

That of course means the Crossbowmen have not reformed to take the charge so you have good chances of being beaten in combat and not being steadfast so will probably be broken. Even with GW's. They will have lances so will be S5 or 6 on the charge and will cut through our T4 like a hot knife through butter.

If you can somehow manage to take away the charge from them or if you can be steadfast after the first round, you will have much better chances. However that would mean reforming before the charge and therefore loosing a round of shooting and getting less shots in the stand and shoot.
If you where to take solid combat units instead you can rank up much deeper and easily weather the first round of combat, after that Knights will melt away in front of your eyes.

The magic resistance is much better, but if you can get a Ro Stone on him it would be a little better.

Edited by Tegnus Vagnarsson, 03 May 2012 - 09:58 AM.


#5 Griegsson

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:16 PM

I love grudge throwers, but against the opponents you list I would drop them here. They are not good against knights (high AS and/or ward) and although they will kill empire troops well, so will anything else you take.

I think the optimum warmachine loadout is probably two cannon (with forging + one cheap rune of choice) and one OG. With the points saved you can buy a spellbreaker or two.

#6 Paddy94

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:30 PM

but probably drop the quarellers right? Have a deep block or two of warriors with GW perhaps?

#7 Tegnus Vagnarsson

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:32 PM

Like I said before, All you need is a runesmith, a couple of combat blocks and a couple of cannons :)

Something like,
Runesmith, shield, Ro Fire, Ro Stone, 2x Spellbreaker
29 Warriors GW's Std Mus
29 Warriors GW's Std Mus
Cannon Ro Forging Ro Burning
Cannon Ro Forging

You know, I'd nearly drop the Ro Fire from the Runesmith, it would be better to go in 5 point down and let him keep his parry save. I don't think the chances of seeing ethereal or regen are very high against Brets or Empire. Especially at this points level.

Edited by Tegnus Vagnarsson, 03 May 2012 - 02:08 PM.






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