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The Army Of Zero Deployments

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#1 Baccahs


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Posted 05 August 2010 - 10:02 PM

Having just fought the wood elves and had them hide in the corner for sox turns shooting me and almost win, I thought of a new army idea that feels fun, but a bit nuts. This is an army with zero initial deployments, its two units of rangers (with Bugman) and three units of miners, so everything is scout and underground advance. No more slogging across the board under a withering hail of missile weapons, you see where the bulk of the enemy is (or where the important stuff you can cream in combat is) and deploy/underground advance you dwarves right to the spot. Maybe your opponent doesn't know what to do in deployment because of this odd situation.

This the beginnings of a list I had in mind, all suggestions and name calling welcome:

Thane BSB, brotherhood and your favorite defensive combo or master rune of challenge + defense
Runesmith, brotherhood and 2xdispel runes, GW

30 rangers, GW full command
25 ranger Longbeards full command (rune banner?)
25 miners, full command
25 miners, full command
25 miners, full command

Comes out to a little over 2000 points (add characters or Miner toys or increase the size of the units for larger games)
less than 25% heroes (@485)
less than 50% special (@870)
at least 25% core (@675)

Are these percentages right? Is this legal? It feels like it would be a ton of fun - in your face Dwarf combat.

#2 Grabgold Thunderbeard

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Posted 06 August 2010 - 01:55 AM

I think these invisible dwarf deployments sound like good fun, your enemy won't know where to look with miners popping up all over the place and (hopefully)flanking him! ^_^
How successful they will actually be, well only time will tell. I will be eagerly waiting to hear how your upcoming battles with this army list come out.

I don't think it's actually legal though unfortunately... remember that bugmans longbeard rangers do not count towards your minimum core choice allowance. ;)

Let me know how it runs. :)

#3 Pwent


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Posted 06 August 2010 - 04:06 AM

I believe they do now in 8th, they didn't count towards a core slot before but apparently they count to % now

#4 Grabgold Thunderbeard

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Posted 06 August 2010 - 04:12 AM

I believe they do now in 8th, they didn't count towards a core slot before but apparently they count to % now

Hey you're totally right, I misread the armybook reference. It clearly says they "do count towards the minimum number of core troops choices in the army". :blush:
In which case it seems like a totally legal list, let me know how it goes! :P

#5 Goztek


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Posted 06 August 2010 - 05:24 AM

Its a good army to try, what i am seeing though is the lack of magic defence and if you have an aod somewhere you can "pop the miners" and charge. There are many dwarf players here and out there that are mixing the ratios of the longbears/rangers/warriors. Even opponents will ask you in friendlies or tournament that your army is illegal but it is not, so here is a small example

To have a unit of Longbeards you need.

1 unit of Warriors
1 Dwarf Lord.

If you have a unit of rangers

You do not need any warriors

If you have a unit of rangers

You do not need any warriors
As stated in the faq. The Longbeard Rangers are now Rangers so they do not count towards the ratio of the Warriors/Longbeards.

I hope i am correct on that.
Thanks and Good Morning

#6 Equlan


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Posted 06 August 2010 - 05:56 AM

The army is perfectly legal in both 7th and 8th edition as near as I can tell, and it seems like a lot of fun to try out just to mess with your opponent!

I'm tempted to steal the idea myself. I'm not sure how well it will work, but it would be hilarious :dance3:

#7 Ok Okri

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Posted 06 August 2010 - 08:39 AM

These type of list are fun to play, and much improved in 8th ed as you no longer require deployable core and rangers can deploy in line of sight. My current dilema is whether to field war machines and/or an anvil.

I'd like to think that a block of GW armed troops could take down pretty much anything, although you might not be left with many! Cannons/stone throwers could be useful for eliminating any big threats, and thinning troops, but then how do you defend them? The anvil will get you more time/more charges, but if undefended could quickly be tied up with hunters or fast cav.

The form of my list (and the others I have seen) is very similar to yours, and I think it is clear that this will be typical of the new wave of ambush armies. I'm considering 2 cannons, or a cannon and stone thrower, spaced well apart in my deployment zone, and undefended. They will provide a juicy distraction for my opponent, but will hopefully have time to damage/kill whatever I am most concerned about. I'm thinking Grungi or Determination on the LB banner to protect them and the warriors from shooting templates in turn one, or from breaking from a bad combat.

As for tactics, I'd be aiming to deploy all charaters with rangers to make sure you have their benefits from turn one (you don't want your rangers being magiced off the board!). I'd usually be planning to deploy both ranger units at one end of the opponent line, then roll up it taking one unit at a time. Bring on miners as reserves to flank charge or replace depleted LB's. You should be aiming to be in 2-on-1 combats for a few turns, with at least one largely complete unit, before your opponent has chance to reorganise his forces and make a last stand!

#8 Farengrim


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Posted 06 August 2010 - 04:10 PM

I have a 2500 points list made up for 8th Edition which is of similar build and concept. I updated it from a list I made in 7th Edition. This kind of list is VERY fun to play with! What I did in my 7th Edition list, and now my 8th, is I included gyrocopters and a unit of steadfast ironbreakers with Strollaz' Rune in the deployment zone. That way, your opponent may not catch on to the plan right off the bat, and the fact that you may say, "yeah...I'm done regular deployment now," will confuse him/her for a moment or two and make a mistake.

The scout rule has been improved that make this list a very playable list compared to 7th Edition. I played this kind of list once against WoC and I hadn't realized when I made the list that scouts needed to be 10" AND out of LoS, and our battlefield was a rather barren one...needless to say things did not go my way.

A word of warning though, this list is hilarious and amazingly fun, but you can only use it once against any opponent or gaming group since they'll catch on way earlier if you try and use it and the main tactic is easily countered. But I say give it a go and have fun!

#9 Granitbeard


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Posted 07 August 2010 - 12:11 PM

You do need a Lord for the LBRs I do believe as that is part of the army book. Other then that all looks good.

I have thought about something like this but never gave it a try. Let us know how it works.

#10 RedZeke


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Posted 07 August 2010 - 01:12 PM

You do need a Lord for the LBRs I do believe as that is part of the army book.

Not quite true. Once warriors or longbeards are promoted to rangers, they don't count as warriors (or longbeards) towards the quota, one way or the other.

#11 hawkeye


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Posted 09 August 2010 - 02:12 AM

I play a Bugman list and have since I started playing Dwarfs last year. The list is not just a one trick pony. Even now in 8th with scouts getting a boost (no longer have to be through interposing terrain). I've played 6 3K games with Dwarfs since the 8th game out and have lost only to Vampire Counts. My Thunderers just didn't feel like being there that day... Had lots of success in 7th as well.

The list is legal from what I can see. One huge advantage you're going to have to knowing where you're opponent is deployed and being able to see every weakness he/ she's got. I'd avoid war machines for the sheer and simple fact I don't know how you ambush somebody while dragging a cannon through the woods. Also, I would never include a flame cannon as it makes no sense to shoot flames through trees.

Give it a shot. Have fun with it! Let us know when you start beating people with it!

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