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Your Wishes For Our 7Th Ed Book.


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#61 Ok Okri

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Posted 02 February 2010 - 02:06 PM

I'm not so supprised. That is a lot for 13pts. A 360 degree los with bs4 crossbows with scout, or 360 degree charge arc with great weapons, relentless, combined with heavy armour, shields, skirmish and Ld 9? They may only have M3, but with relentless, skirmish, and scout they're going to be quite agile. They're also going to be pretty impossible to clear by shooting. Like other skirmishers they won't have the static combat res, but with charging great weapons they're going to do some damage, and with heavy armour and Ld9 they may just stick around for a while if they don't win.

#62 Demrog

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Posted 02 February 2010 - 02:32 PM

What kind of points would you expect to pay, is 18pts realistic then?

#63 jayfuture187

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Posted 02 February 2010 - 05:20 PM

I just mooted this idea to my gaming group and they were resoundingly negative about the whole idea.

For something along the lines of the above they are expecting 18+pts per model and saying i should stick with scouts as they are and that they are the way they are as a design decision therefore it works...

So far the replies have come from players that play HE/DE/WE and Tomb Kings.



No wonder they dont like your idea there all Elves! anything that puts them at -1 to hit makes elves skittish..........

#64 Ok Okri

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Posted 02 February 2010 - 06:43 PM

Rangers - Core unit. Points/Model: 13

M 3, WS 4, BS 4, S 3, T 4, W 1, I 2, A 1, Ld 9

Unit size: 10+

Weapons and armor: heavy armor, hand weapon, great weapons, shields, throwing axes

Options:

-may exchange great weapons for crossbows for free.
- may upgrade to longbeards for +3 pts a model. Longbeards have +1 ws, +1 str. You may not have more longbeard units than standard rangers.
- may upgrade one ranger to champion for 10 pts. He gains +1 attack.

Special rules: scout, skirmisher, forester


In my head I was comparing your suggestions to Dark Elf shades. I find those to be quite a pest, and I see your rangers working a similar way.

My thinking goes thus:
A shade with light armour has +1BS and +1WS, scout and skirmish for 7 points more than a Dark Elf crossbowman, it is also takes a special slot.

In comparison to a quarreller your ranger has +1BS, scout and skirmish. In line with the above, you're probably looking at 6 points added to a quarreller. But, you've also added heavy armour (+1), a shield (+1), throwing axes (+1). That puts you at around 20pts, and yet your unit still counts as core.

I wouldn't like to suggest a point value, as I'm not a games designer, and couldn't put a price to the synergies. A comparison like this is not sufficient to set a figure, but it does give you an idea. I think you're doing well if your group will let you field them at 18 points.

#65 Shelfunit

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Posted 02 February 2010 - 10:23 PM

Definately bombs on the gyrocopter - come on, they are even on the model!
Warriors to come equiped with shields as standard - for the same points as a shieldless warrior in the current ed - everyone elses troops get a points drop, I just want shields as standard.
Possibly change the anvil so ALL runesmiths/runelords can take them, but completely change their effects ie magic res (1) and contain "bound rune" power level 5 of one of the current anvil's effects each turn - runelord adds +1 to bound power 35-45 pts.
Stone golems maybe - just something that removes the gunline or very fortunate anvil powered advance.

#66 jayfuture187

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Posted 03 February 2010 - 12:51 AM

Possibly change the anvil so ALL runesmiths/runelords can take them, but completely change their effects ie magic res (1) and contain "bound rune" power level 5 of one of the current anvil's effects each turn - runelord adds +1 to bound power 35-45 pts.


The problem i have with this is that The Anvils of Doom are fluff wise very rare and only the original Holds in the Worlds edge mountains where gifted with them by Grungni at the moment only about five are still in the hands of the dwarfs so are only used by the most venerable Runelords....

#67 Shelfunit

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Posted 03 February 2010 - 09:43 AM

Possibly change the anvil so ALL runesmiths/runelords can take them, but completely change their effects ie magic res (1) and contain "bound rune" power level 5 of one of the current anvil's effects each turn - runelord adds +1 to bound power 35-45 pts.


The problem i have with this is that The Anvils of Doom are fluff wise very rare and only the original Holds in the Worlds edge mountains where gifted with them by Grungni at the moment only about five are still in the hands of the dwarfs so are only used by the most venerable Runelords....


True, but you know how GW are with fluff - remember, for no good reason "wood" almost ceased to exist for us as a weapon making material between the last edition and the current one :wacko: I mean, yes metal is nice and grumbling is much more effective when the weapons I carry now weigh 5 times as much, but come on, axes are for more than just orc skulls aren't they?

#68 jayfuture187

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Posted 03 February 2010 - 11:37 AM

True, but you know how GW are with fluff - remember, for no good reason "wood" almost ceased to exist for us as a weapon making material between the last edition and the current one :wacko: I mean, yes metal is nice and grumbling is much more effective when the weapons I carry now weigh 5 times as much, but come on, axes are for more than just orc skulls aren't they?



But that in itself is fluffy as well to a certain point The dwarfs ended up almost wiping out all the forests of mountain oak in the worlds edge mountains, As it was the only wood that the dwarfs traditionaly used, and other types of oak where to weak for there needs had to use primarily metal to craft there warmachines and weapons, Though high priced furniture is still made using Wutroth oak if they can find a secluded area of it.

Edited by jayfuture187, 03 February 2010 - 11:39 AM.


#69 Shelfunit

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Posted 03 February 2010 - 12:53 PM

Though high priced furniture is still made using Wutroth oak if they can find a secluded area of it.


Probably not as comfortable as good old stone ^_^

#70 ross muldoon

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Posted 04 February 2010 - 05:02 PM

i thought of wish today because we are a defensive army and always get charged so id love to have the option for are warriors to take spears(pikes)they would work great in a dwarf army?

#71 RedZeke

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Posted 04 February 2010 - 09:02 PM

Random thought for a revision- the MR of Disguise could be a handy item for war machines by simply allowing them to deploy when scouts go down. Still restricted to your deployment zone, but gives a little "Surprise!" aspect of the disguise rune while avoiding any tedious book-keeping style deployment.

RZ

#72 Ok Okri

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Posted 05 February 2010 - 10:46 AM

i thought of wish today because we are a defensive army and always get charged so id love to have the option for are warriors to take spears(pikes)they would work great in a dwarf army?



I'd love to see pikes brought back. I used to arm all my warriors with pikes back in 4th ed.

#73 Manbane

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 10:02 PM

Some ideas, tossed out there , of cource I do not mean that all should be given to us, but maybe there is some ide that is good for the next book

Core

Thunders
1. Turn AND Fire for thunders, So that we can reform/turn but not move and still fire.
Possible limitation: loose the +1to hit when you turn and fire

2. Kneel and fire, thunders can kneel and fire, giving them the ability to shoot in 2 ranks.
Possible limitation: either the kneeling rang looses the +1 to hit, or you can only do this on short range.

Quarrelers
1. Possible to buy fire bolts, giving firedamge +1pts per model

Warriors
1. Unit champion is a longbeared

Longbeareds
1. Having been around for a long time they have hatred vs all only in the first round of combat, after all there is allways a slight in the book of grudges from all other races.
Possible limitation: You need to roll a LD to remeber the slight and gain the hatred.

2. Same as above but you can remind other dwarf units with 6'' of the old grudges gaining hatred for the first round of combat.

Special
Slayers
1 Slayers will allways strike back (killed or not)

2 Unerving, -1 to hit slayers also work on shooting

3 Slayers move act as skirmishers when not in hth combat, somewhat like the bestherds

4 When fighting unit with us > 2 per model, slayers T is raised to 5 representing there leet monster fighting skills

5 Go to ground, not wanting to die a meesly death from ranged attack the slayer unit hits the ground/dodges when target by missilefire that uses BS, adding an -1 to hit.

Ironbreakers
1. Can follow a miner unit that is atleast 1/2 the IB units US when the miners use there underground advance.

Hammers (Move them to rare, make 1 unit special slot if a Lord is taken)
1. Fell sweep, hoisting there weapons before reciving a charge the hammer falls even if the wielder dies(All hammers gets to strike back even if they die when reciving a charge). Only works if charged in the front.

2. If loosing a round of combat and not breaking, the hammers will fight even harder. All hammers in the front rang gain a extra attack.
Possible limitation: Flailing there hammers wildly they loose -1 armoursave.

3. If joined by a lord and the lord takes atleast 1 points of damage in one round of combat (and is not in a challange), the hammers will at the start of the next round redouble there effort to protect lord, granting the Lord a look out sir roll for the killing blow for the next round only.

Miners
1. During the turn they emerge the miners stay just below the surface of the mininghole they just dug, counting as beeing in hardcover

2. Instead of moving, the miners can dig them self down, doing so will make the miners get the bonus of hardcover.

3. Instead of making the underground advance during setup, the Miners can dig down a unit not more then double the miner units US and grant them the bonus of hardcover. The miner unit then deploy as usall.

Cannons
1 1d6 damge.
Possible limitation: realy no.. just give it to us!

Grudgethrower
1 Rune that gives partial hits on 3+ instead of 4+ (But I heared partials are beeing removed in the next edition)

Boltthrower
1 Stand and shoot.

Rare
Organ gun
1 Make it runable, we have had them long enugh now

Flame cannon
1 Make it runable, we have had them long enugh now

2 Lower the points to 120 OR make it have a built in rune of immolation.

3 Add stand and shoot to it

Gyrocopter
1 Bring back the gyro chrash rules

2 Make it a upgrade for Master enginers

3 Make it a kamikaze upgrade for dragonslayers, same rules as usall, but when it dies the slayer can stear it into a unit where it explodes as per the old chrash rules.


Army rules
New special rule for Ironbreakers,Hammers, Longbeared if they have a banner.
Iron wedge: Lowers the enemy flee range with 1 for every point of CR they lost the battle with. Representing our elite infantery driving a wedge into the enemy and making it harder for them to disengage. This should make it more likely to catch and destroy units allowing us to gather more VP and giving us more of a chanse in tournaments, since our biggest weeknes is not that we can not win matches, but that we can not win big.

Anvil not a thought out ide, but some thing in the line of....
Remake it so it can never missfire/be destroyed but can be dispelled, use it kind of like the Tomekings incantations work. you can strike all 3 runes each round in a specifik order, each rune is a bound spell with a power of 2d6. Maybe change out some or add some runes. The dwarf powerdies can be added to any rune struck.


New army rule, (Insert a suiting name here) allows all dwarf units to walk in to hand to hand combat as per the old rules (5th edition?), the dwarfs can turn and walk into hth with neither side counting as charging. This and our relentless rule will give us a realy edge in close quarter melee.

Edited by Manbane, 16 February 2010 - 10:03 PM.





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